Join Marco Ciappelli and Dr. Bruce Y. Lee for an in-depth discussion on the evolving role of technology in shaping society, privacy concerns, and the impact of AI on our biases and digital footprints.
Guest: Dr. Bruce Y Lee, Executive Director of PHICOR (Public Health Informatics, Computational, and Operations Research) [@PHICORteam]
On LinkedIn | https://www.linkedin.com/in/bruce-y-lee-68a6834/
On Twitter | https://twitter.com/bruce_y_lee
Website | https://www.bruceylee.com/
On Forbes | https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/
On Psychology Today | https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/contributors/bruce-y-lee-md-mba
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Host: Marco Ciappelli, Co-Founder at ITSPmagazine [@ITSPmagazine] and Host of Redefining Society Podcast
On ITSPmagazine | https://www.itspmagazine.com/itspmagazine-podcast-radio-hosts/marco-ciappelli
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Episode Introduction
Welcome to a new episode of the "Redefining Society" podcast, where we engage in thought-provoking conversations at the crossroads of technology, society, and personal identity. In this episode, I, Marco Ciappelli, am excited to host Dr. Bruce Y. Lee, a renowned thinker in the realm of digital culture and technological evolution. Our dialogue today spans a broad spectrum of topics, including shifts in job trends influenced by technological advancements, the cultural and social impacts of emerging tech, and the increasingly complex issues surrounding privacy in the digital age.
As we dive into our discussion, Dr. Lee and I explore the double-edged sword of technology: its potential to challenge or reinforce societal biases. We delve into the intricacies of data generation and consumption, examining how the algorithms that shape our digital experiences can inadvertently perpetuate existing prejudices or open doors to more inclusive perspectives. This conversation underscores the crucial role that awareness and critical thinking play in navigating the digital landscape.
Another focal point of our conversation is the notion of privacy in today’s interconnected world. We discuss the challenges individuals face in making informed decisions about their online presence, especially considering the often convoluted privacy settings of digital platforms. These settings, sometimes defaulting to over-sharing, highlight the need for vigilance and understanding in managing our digital footprints.
Furthermore, we delve into the potential of artificial intelligence as a mirror reflecting our societal values and shortcomings. AI's influence in our lives is undeniable, yet it raises essential questions about the nature of the information we share and the consequences of these shared data. Dr. Lee and I dissect the complexities of AI development, emphasizing the importance of infusing ethical considerations into the fabric of these technologies.
Throughout our dialogue, we aim to shed light on the intricate web that technology weaves in our lives. From influencing job markets to shaping cultural norms and personal privacy, the digital world presents a labyrinth of challenges and opportunities. Our goal is to illuminate these paths, offering insights and fostering a deeper understanding of the role technology plays in redefining society.
Tune in to this episode for an enlightening journey through the multifaceted world of technology, as we explore its profound implications on society and the individual.
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Resources
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Please note that this transcript was created using AI technology and may contain inaccuracies or deviations from the original audio file. The transcript is provided for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon as a substitute for the original recording, as errors may exist. At this time, we provide it “as it is,” and we hope it can be helpful for our audience.
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[00:00:00] Marco Ciappelli: Hello, everybody. This is Marco Ciapelli, another episode of Redefining Society podcast. Another day, same bar, my same friend, Dr. Bruce Y. Lee, back in the bar, as I mentioned, the one where we usually meet. Last time you were traveling and I may, I did miss that background for people that are now watching.
There's a beautiful bar. Looks like a, uh, Almost sci fi though.
[00:00:27] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah, I'm back in the bar. There's no other customers here. So I'm getting a little suspicious, um, that maybe I, you know, we should check the drinks to make sure that they're okay. But, uh, yeah, no, no other customers, but thanks again for joining me or, uh, connecting with me in the, in this bar.
[00:00:44] Marco Ciappelli: I'm in the, actually, you should share the background with me. So next time we're. Both pretending to really be in the same bar. Pretending?
[00:00:54] Bruce Y. Lee: Oh no, we are. We're actually in a bar, what are you talking about?
[00:00:56] Marco Ciappelli: Virtual bar is a real bar. The line between reality and virtuality, it's, uh, it is not there anymore.
And, uh, of course we can talk about this, but just to give a little, Introduction to this conversation. This is part of the series, which I think is episode five, something like that, of a carbon, a silicon, and a cell walk into a bar. And I guess they strike a conversation about humanity, technology, and healthcare.
And that's why We are in the bar. Where have you been going, um, before coming in the bar? Uh, I know you have been going into many other virtual places called podcast. Busy day.
[00:01:44] Bruce Y. Lee: Uh, today is actually a podcast and talk heavy day. Uh, I have to, I'm giving a Uh, uh, talk with, uh, uh, NIH initiative, um, on, um, uh, COVID 19 modeling.
I gave a podcast earlier today on, uh, public health, different types of public health matters and technology related to public health. So yeah it's a busy podcast and talk day.
[00:02:11] Marco Ciappelli: Sounds like my day. So good. I made a joke at the beginning before we started actually recording off of the record, but I'm going to bring it back.
And I started, I said that I started doing podcasting about two years, three years ago. And I really love it. I do some day four or five podcast and it comes easy to me. Sometimes I have no idea what we're going to talk about like right now, but I feel like it's just sitting at the table and having a coffee and having a conversation.
I put that in my mind and I wonder, uh, that's a good job. I wanted to have maybe 20 years ago. So I wonder why didn't I start it? And you said to me, sometimes there is people that find their vocation a lot earlier and some other need to experience different, I call it different lives. I had, I think at least three different lives that I lived so far.
[00:03:13] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah. Well, Marco, you're certainly very good at, uh, being a podcast host because I think you, you know, a lot, first of all, you know, a lot like that, you know, so the, your bank of knowledge is immense. So you can have a conversation on almost anything. Uh, but you're also very good at putting people at ease and maintaining conversation and really kind of generating insights, right?
You ask great questions and those things like that. Um, and plus you joined me in this bar. So I think you're, Yeah. I'm
[00:03:43] Marco Ciappelli: perfect. I'm like CHAT GPT. I'm perfect.
[00:03:46] Bruce Y. Lee: There we go. Yes. Maybe too perfect. So, but it's interesting. Yeah. Because I think we were talking about how, uh, you know, I think with both of us, it took a while for us to figure out.
Uh, what we liked and what we didn't like, you know, career wise, et cetera, because, you know, a big part of it is trying on different outfits, trying on different things which is relevant to the Halloween decor that's behind you. Right. So you have to put on these different costumes. And I remember.
When I was in medical school, I was amazed because some of my classmates were so clear in terms of what they wanted and what their passions were. Like, I remember one person saying that, uh, she wanted to be a neurosurgeon since five, five years old. And I was thinking, what was I doing at five? Probably like smearing food on my face and something like that.
And I remember something about like hanging out, like in a fork or something like that, that we Bill, but I. I had no concept, but this person said she was sort of like this dissecting animals, I guess, at age five. I don't know why anyone would allow a five year old to do that, but, um, so I was quite amazed at how there are some people who.
Either are convinced that they really like something early on or are, or hit their passions quite early. Uh, whereas, you know, I think in many cases, it really, you really need to try on different things and you need to kind of go through the bumps and bruises of life to figure out what you really like and what you don't like sometimes it's process of elimination.
Where you're sitting there and say, okay, I did not like that. I do not want to do that again. Um, and then you start like kind of X ing things off. And eventually you start moving more towards what you actually are interested in doing. But yeah I had no idea for a long time.
[00:05:40] Marco Ciappelli: Well, you knew you wanted an ice cream or something at five.
Like what am I going to do next? That's what I want. Yes. So you said something that kind of caught my attention, which is you either really have a vocation or you think you have a vocation. And that could come, I think from your family. For example, a lot of people become musicians because their parents are musicians.
They become writer because their parents are writer. And I think that's great because you are the consequence of. You know, your persona, your genetics your DNA and what is engraved in your DNA, but also the social demographic that you grew up with. Maybe you have a friend that is, their parents are a musician and you decide, Hey, that's cool.
Cause you kind of absorb that, but yeah, knowing that you want to be a neurosurgeon of five, where'd that come from? And maybe somebody saw something on TV and said that's cool.
[00:06:42] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah. I remember, um, uh, a friend of mine had a, uh, relative or someone like that, that, uh, was interested and said, Oh, you know, I wanted to talk, uh, uh, she wanted to talk about, uh, this relative, uh, wanted to talk about, uh, uh, you know, a medical career or health career or something like that.
And I said, sure. Happy to talk. And I think this. This relative was probably like 11 years old or 12, and I said, sure, happy. So I figured the conversation would be like, Oh, what's healthcare like? Or, you know, what's it mean to be a doctor and those things like that. And, um, so, but when I got a conversation, this 11 year old was saying, I'm debating between working in one of two different, uh, NIH laboratories, uh, a rheumatology one, or another like neurology one.
I want you to know which one I should work in. And I was like, Wow, she's 11. And I said, well, I guess at that age, I was sort of trying to like, you know, playing, like, hanging around an arcade, playing video games and things like that. So, or like playing sports and things like that. So, Uh, so I did say, well, part of the, one of the things that you want to do is you want to try different things and see if you actually like this.
Um, and, uh, she was like, I want one answer or the other. Rheumatology lab or neurology lab. It's a very focused, um, and. Yeah, so maybe she took an interest in that, or maybe it was something which was conditioned from what she saw around herself, or from her family, or something like that. So if it's the latter, then you have to ask yourself whether it's actually what you ultimately want to do.
Um, so, uh, so yeah, uh, it can get complex trying to sort out these different types of influences and what you actually want to do.
[00:08:33] Marco Ciappelli: I think it's relatively easy and I don't want to, don't want to have a bunch of, uh, you know, 10 years old kids, uh, that maybe listen to this to write me that. I said something wrong, but I want to say that it's easy at that age, maybe because you don't know enough.
So it's, eventually you may end up trying other things and maybe you like that. And I have the proof of that by the many conversations that I do have. Writers. They started as something else most of the time, uh, I, you know, some of them, they have degrees in astronomy, physicist, their medical doctor, and then they end up, their passion is actually writing and they do use their knowledge and their, and what they write about because they know about So, yeah.
And so, you know, it's nice we focus, but I think it's also, it could be a negative thing. I think staying open it's virtue in, especially in our world nowadays.
[00:09:41] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah, there's, you know, there's a need for, there's certainly a need for specialists and people who focus. We need, but not everyone.
That's not for everyone, right? So there are people who want to say, I want to start really early on something. I know I want to do this and I will do nothing but this and just focus focus, focus. You know, there are people who decide very early on, I want to play a sport and I just want to be in that sport for the rest of my life.
[00:10:05] Marco Ciappelli: And that helped because you need to start
[00:10:07] Bruce Y. Lee: early. Exactly. Yeah. Golfing. Someone wants to be a golfer that you can be a golfer your entire life. You can start off, you know, and become, you know, if you're talented enough to become a professional later, be kind of coach and commentator, you know, all those things like that.
You can spend your entire life in golfing. And that's great. You're very focused. And at some point you will know more about golfing than 99. 999 percent of people in the world. And you need people like that. Certainly like you don't want, you don't want if someone is, um, Operating on you.
You don't want that person to say let me think about something else. Right. Well, I'll bring, so there's a need for people who are very focused and, um, and know things very well. But at the same time, there is also a need for people who kind of cross different areas. And, um, so you shouldn't feel like, oh, if you're bouncing around doing different things that it's not going to land you in an effective career or that you can't contribute to society.
In fact, a lot of, and taking this back to technology, a lot of the technological breakthroughs are, occur when you've got people who've seen different things and then they say, let me apply this to this and let's see what happens. We combine these two things. Um, and so we tend to under. estimate how often that happens or undersell how often that happens.
Um, so yeah, so it's important to keep in mind.
[00:11:26] Marco Ciappelli: Well, it's the thinking outside the box. If you're always in that environment, you're always thinking about that problem and you have this, you know, amount of knowledge that is very focused. It's hard to get outside of the box and having a third eye perspective.
It's kind of like one of those situation where you're thinking about a problem that you're in a brainstorming and then somebody walk in the room and look at the, I don't know, the board for five seconds and like, um, What about this? And everybody's like, holy shit, I didn't think about it because they come with a fresh perspective.
And I think that we can start talking more about the technology aspect here, because I'm wondering if information access to what we didn't have. before the radio, the TV, then the internet. I mean, now we really have, again, everything we need in the palm of our hands. We have every mass media, all the books, all the newspaper, all the radio, the podcast, and so on.
And if we don't know something, it's just because maybe there is too much to know, but we could. And we can look into other possibility. While before your world was so much smaller that, yeah, I'm going to do what my family is doing. Uh, side, uh, side movement was much harder before.
[00:12:59] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah. I remember, um, watching an interview once of Keith Richards, uh, who's, you know, the guitarist for the Rolling Stones.
Um, and I'm not going to. imitate how he talked or anything, but I remember him saying, and I'm paraphrasing, but, uh, I remember him saying that, or he's saying that, uh, you know, when they come up with new songs, he said, they're not like new jumps. He said, they're actually just taking a lot of different old stuff and like connecting it in different ways.
Um, and, you know, he was pointing out how like the chord progressions were similar to a lot of the blues stuff before. So we have this. It's a bit of a myth to think that, you know, these big breakthroughs, technology breakthroughs occurs when someone goes in like in their shower and they're like, aha, or I described this as the Tony Stark effect.
So if you watch the Iron Man or Avengers movies, like, you know, what was Avengers Endgame, they're like, Oh let's figure out time travel. And then they go into. You know, the lab and figure out time to that's not how innovation actually works. Innovation works because, uh, you know, people are kind of mixing ideas and experiences.
And then, you know, there's a little twist. There's a little, you know, let's apply this to this etcetera. So we're all like relying on. So, so you're absolutely right. Can technology actually bring us in contact with more things? Can it promote mixing of ideas? Um, and which is actually the opposite of like, our society has been moving more and more towards super specialization.
Uh, you know, over the past, Uh, bunch of decades, right? Because the thinking is like, Oh, there's so much knowledge to know in one thing. So they have to spend all your time in that thing. So I still remember there was someone who was an ophthalmologist and say, well, I only deal with one part of the eye.
You know, he don't want to part though. He said, I don't like the other parts of the eye. I just want to deal with this one part of the eye. Um, so, so yeah, I think there is a need to balance things off. So we can have more cross fertilization. Uh, and get some of those real interesting ideas that come from mixing amongst things so technology can facilitate it.
But you also have to encourage people who are interested in doing that. Um, uh, to move forward.
[00:15:17] Marco Ciappelli: Yeah, absolutely. And I think that from different perspective, it comes. a better world too, a better society. Because again, if you just see in front of your eyes and you don't see everything that happened around you, you think the world is in a certain way, but actually it's not.
[00:15:36] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah, technology can help or hurt. So, you know as we always say Uh technology is neither good nor bad, right? It's what technology can actually do You know, we know that technology has helped uh humankind incredibly Uh technology is also hurt because you know, you can develop Very destructive things from technology as well.
So the key is whenever it emerges, we have to ask ourselves, how does it actually fit into society? How does it actually advance, uh, individuals and, you know, population needs. Um, and you know, you mentioned sort of diversity and, uh, equity inclusion, all those things like that, which, which are, you know, which are important because if you really want to harness the potential of.
People and, you know, come up with the best ideas and advanced society. You really need to lean on many people of different perspectives and backgrounds. Um, and, uh, so that people can, you know, really work together to advance society. There, there's so many studies that show like species that have more biological diversity, for instance, tend to become more dominant or, um, or grow.
Uh, but we have to keep in mind that, so we have to ask ourselves, how can technology help and how can it hurt? So yeah, it can certainly help by connecting people. It can certainly help by helping people do more, like they can share information. They can work with, you know, now you can work with people around, you know, halfway around the world.
Like it's no, no big deal. It used to be that if you want to work with someone in another... CHAT GPT. If technology is pushing things one direction, so for instance, you know, I was, uh, uh, gave a talk, uh, the other day where I was talking about how AI, you know, algorithms in AI can actually introduce more bias.
If you don't really check the algorithm, so say you take data, let's say for argument's sake, you take data and this data is from, uh, on people from like the most exclusive neighborhoods in, I don't know, Beverly Hills or uh, Silicon Valley, and that's the training data for an AI algorithm. Then all the insights will be based on that population specifically, and it's not gonna apply to other populations.
So you're going to have something that's going to be heavily biased. So let's say you have this kind of app that's based on an AI algorithm from some of those neighbors and say, this is what you need. You need to get yourself a masseuse and you need to have like organic vegetables every single day.
And by the way, you should have a chef. And then, so that may be great if you can do that, but like, if you're sitting there in another part of the country, part of the world, and you're thinking, I'm, I'm going to need a masseuse, that's the solution. So, um, so that will be an example of something that doesn't recognize diversity around, and then you're coming up with solutions and you're actually worsening sort of disparities between people because everything's going to be based on it and say, well, let's base all our, everything we do on getting a masseuse.
You know? So, so there are many examples of how it can either help or hurt, uh, a lot of those, uh, different things. But
[00:19:11] Marco Ciappelli: you know, I'm going to be a little bit, uh, controversial here because I use this quite a bit. I even wrote a piece or maybe I have it in my mind, I haven't wrote it yet, but it's about the fact that I always say that, you know, artificial intelligence, generative artificial intelligence is human because it is.
Learning from human all the content that we have created movies, newspaper, books, all of that conversation on the Internet, which include a lot of biases because that's how we are. That's what we're seeing. It's a mirror. in actually learning what direction we've been going for the longest time. But on the flip side, I, from a sociology perspective, I need to justify that because that's how the history was.
So now we can see 360, right? Because we have access to that. I can go on the internet and see how people live in Bali. without having to go there. Although being there, you should go. It's fantastic. You can do that for another culture, Japan, New Zealand, just to go on that side, or Paraguay on the other side.
And before we didn't have that opportunity. So those biases was because you, somebody was just living in Beverly Hill. Somebody was just living in uh, in Quebec or in Argentina. And so we didn't have different perspective. And I get that with even my dad. Which is, a different generation.
And, uh, sometimes I try to make him understand from, you know, to have a more open mind and he's open minded is, but he grew up in a, don't touch Florence, like whatever we do in Florence, literally it's how the world should think and cause you, you grew up there. So I think this is a very revolutionary moment in our evolution where we have access to so much and instead of using it against each other, we should use it as to come together.
[00:21:30] Bruce Y. Lee: Exactly. I think one of the things just to keep in mind is, um, yeah, there's a lot of, a lot more information that's available on the internet. And I'm basically. You know, these AI and machine learning approaches now has access to more information. And so you're absolutely right. It's as opposed to before where you might have access to local information.
Um, so, but we also have to remember that even if there's greater access, that information can still be biased and it all depends on the curation of that information. So, you know, what sector of the information on the internet are you actually using? For the algorithm for the AI algorithm, machine learning algorithm.
And we also know that there, there is a difference between, um, history that's been documented and things that have not been documented. So, you know, you go through history. I remember, you know, you go through history classes as a kid and it's sort of presented as facts. You know, these are, this is what happened, et cetera.
But then as you move along, you start realizing. Well, a lot of that history is presented as a perspective. So, like, for instance, in the United States, the history books presented, you don't see the history from Native American point of view. Like, I'm sure if they wrote a history book, it would be very different.
If someone from, you know, uh, uh, Native American backgrounds have writ, wrote the history books for the schools, it'd be quite different. Same can be applied for every different social demographic because people have different perspectives. Um, so we have to remember that all of these things are from one perspective, they're from, uh, bias.
So we can't assume that the data that's out there is really kind of unbiased and even like, for instance, if you sat there and said, okay uh, you know, we do a thought experiment, say about 30 years ago, we say, um, uh, And we took the same algorithms that we have to the CHAT GPT or other things, uh, and take them back there and say, uh, uh, tell us a superhero story, you know, give us a, you know, generate a screenplay for a superhero movie.
Well, back then the superhero movies were less diverse, right? Okay. So you may be, you know, I Supergirl as some of those, uh, like, like one off TV shows or movies there. So, but like it predominantly. A certain type of person. Now it's changed a little bit. Like you have a little more diversity in the superhero movies.
Still, we have a ways to go. Um, so you can see the difference in terms of what it would return. Right. And that has nothing to do with quote, fact or reality. Like a superhero can look like anyone or anything like, but it's based on that information out there that said, this is what a superhero looks like because these are the movies that we had at the time.
[00:24:37] Marco Ciappelli: I love it. It's a good thought experiment there, and it makes me think, and also connect to things that we have known from philosophy, for example, that history is written by the winners, not the loser. You just may give us a really good example there. And those are the ones that write the books. I mean, I'm Italian.
So I'm allowed to talk really bad about Columbus, right? So, uh, the other day it was Columbus day. I'm not a fan, but when I was a kid, damn, the guy was a hero. You know, he took three boats and La Nina, La Pinta, La Santa Maria, and he went, and he, oh my God, and then you find out that he didn't really. Do many good things for the people that made money out of it.
Um, I'm not going to get too much into that. But again that's who writes history and that's. And also, it's not very democratic the way that we create content either. And that's an example. But even now, in the time of technology, we think that everybody's having the iPhone, the computer, the connection to the internet.
So that everybody is a content creator, but is it really everybody a content creator? There's people that do not? I mean, it's... The access to technology is not for everyone. We think it is the same way. We think that everybody thinks the way we do the same way. We think that, you know, we look around. Yep.
This is the world. Uh, this is how the world look like. And it's not true. So we still have a long way to go.
[00:26:27] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah. And even if you have access to the internet, and I should say, if, because there are still a significant number of people who don't have access to the internet, even if you have access to the internet, even if you create content and then upload it on a social media site, whether it's YouTube or, uh, you know, Instagram or what have you, there are algorithms in there that will then determine, you know, how likely your stuff is going to be seen.
Yeah. Um, you know, you open up those things, not everyone is going to be looking at the same thing. Um, you know, if you opened up someone's YouTube page and like, there are all these videos on doughnuts, then you can take a wild guess of what that person actually likes, right? So, but that's based on the algorithm.
And so these algorithms many times are not, you know, transparent, so you don't know what is actually feeling them because they then determine who sees what. Um, so it is not, it's not an equal playing field. If you post something, um, you may or may not now, of course people are trying to.
Gamed algorithms, they sit there and say, okay, but there's only so much you can game because you may not, you don't know what the base algorithm actually is.
[00:27:38] Marco Ciappelli: And it is not a, again, it is not a fair representation of reality. Everybody has his own reality. Sure, we can go philosophical with that. But even when you search on Google, my search result is not your search result.
And people don't understand that. Because think about Amazon. Great example. They pretty much invented the if this, then that, right? Oh, if you like this, then you can do that. And Netflix jump on the board. And. And that's why they're so successful, both of them. But people still think that their interface is the same than everybody else, but this is not like walking into, I don't know, target.
If me and you walk into the same target, it's going to look the same. We are in the same physical place. Your online target is probably different than mine, but here's another one. Your target, where you live. In what part of the world or any other multinational company is different from the target where I live because they know what people in that social demographic area like.
So we are very much manipulated.
[00:28:54] Bruce Y. Lee: Oh, absolutely. I like to tell the story that, uh, I was writing a article for Forbes about, um, Uh, you know, people were wondering whether, uh, COVID 19 could be transmitted via farts. So, I was, you know, that meant I did, you know, I looked up farts on, you know, Google. And then also, around that time, you know, I happened to be...
Uh, watching some like, I don't know, animal videos or cat videos and things like that. So you open up YouTube. What do I get? I get lots of videos on animals farting. So basically I took and combined the two and for a little while I was being. You know, presented with a lot of things about animals farting.
Um, I would not recommend a lot of these videos, but, uh, but yeah. So, so they basically are using algorithms to figure out what you want. And so then you're absolutely right. You're going to have a different tailored experience compared to someone else.
[00:29:50] Marco Ciappelli: Yeah. And it's far away from being perfect because the access to what you, who you are, it's very limited.
Thankfully, I mean, there and that's another conversation about privacy that we can have. I had a few of these. Actually, I had a conversation with my friends, Chris Pearson from Black Cloak and he we were analyzing. I don't know if you've seen it, but , Mozilla organization did a report on cars and everything that a car.
And it's, they collect so much data and this is 25 of the top car manufacturer in the world. They analyze everything about the car, which is their justification. And it's true. You know, how many miles are you doing? Is your bumpers okay? Is your lights working? And one thing and another, how can we improve the car and your own experience?
But then it comes down to, they know where you're going. It comes down that they look at you through your own telephone that you put in there called telephone, the smartphone that you put in there. And they even collect information about your sexual orientation, your taste. Um, there are cars with cameras in it, so they can help you if you fall asleep on the, while you're driving, but they also can see many other things.
So, What we were talking and where I'm going with this is that if you want your artificial intelligence assistant to be very helpful, it needs to know a lot about you. You can't just say, hey, find me my favorite restaurants. It can be like, CHAT GPT will be like, okay, um, what is your favorite food? What's your budget?
Where do you live? So if you don't share enough, it can't give you good results. So I'm connected to the fact that maybe it's a good thing that they think that you like animals farting because it means that they probably don't know enough about you. So on one side we want The perfect recommendation, but we also don't want to share all the privacy information, the private information that we will have to share in order to get very relevant recommendation.
That's another thought. That's another thought to have right there.
[00:32:20] Bruce Y. Lee: It's interesting. I, and I was also asked this question on a, um, uh, podcast earlier today about, uh, you know, uh, should people be worried about. Um, information being shared or sharing their information. Um, and it's easy to forget because like you said, you when someone buys a car, they think of just, it's my car, you know, and people do all kinds of things in cars.
So, um, you know, uh, but they don't think about. So if you were asked someone and said, would you go to a street corner or would you like, uh, and work or you, would you like walk into like, you know, a mall and start shouting, saying, everyone, I want to let you know everything about my body, everything that I do, please listen, you know, and you basically just spill it and, you know, here's some secrets about me.
Like most people would say, no, I. Don't want to do that, but we have to remember that, yeah, with some of these things, depending on what the agreement is, that information freely flows and you are actually transmitting this information to many other people. Um, so. It's this balance between you want this convenience in life.
You want someone, you know, this device, know everything about you so that they can tailor things to you. But at the same time, how much are you talking? Like, what are you actually saying? No. Um, so, so I guess, I guess the, uh, the warning here is, um, be careful what you tell your car.
[00:33:52] Marco Ciappelli: Or your phone.
Yeah. Yep. Because you may just say something and then all of a sudden Instagram is going to show you something that you didn't actually look for, but that you said something. I mean, the microphone is there and there's way, there's ways to use it and access it. Uh, it's, yeah, I think though, every time we have this kind of conversation, it comes down to education.
You're not going to be able to stop it. We're not going to be able to stop it because we're going to use it. We're going to use it, we need it, but you need to make educated decisions. And unfortunately, I don't think the companies are helping in making these educated decisions. Um, for example, Why are we opt in most of these things by default while we should be opt out by default?
Why do I have to go to my smart TV and turn off every single possible thing that could be Intrusive in my privacy while it should actually come and say well, it's all locked Now these are the things that you can do if you want to have a better Uh, here, quote, experience or a more complete experience with what the technology can do.
Uh, you can turn this on and this on, and it's easy then to turn it off if you change your mind, but God, they make it hard.
[00:35:17] Bruce Y. Lee: Absolutely. Yeah. Or sometimes you have to go back even though you opt out of certain things, then they'll do that. You know, you go to like, uh, Google privacy settings, right?
So you, you get rid of like a lot of those ad things. And then, you know, a few months later, you realize that they've changed everything. So then you have to, it's just gone back to their default, which is share everything. And then you have to go check it again. Right. So,
[00:35:41] Marco Ciappelli: which is really not good. Yeah.
That's really not good. Well, so I guess we, we jumped from, uh, uh, Changing jobs. We could have talked more about that, but I know we're running out of time. You have like other 65 podcasts today to do, and I need to plan more of mine. But, um, I think that's a topic we should go back into again. Like, you know, migrating from a job to another and how technology can help, for example, and deciding that.
But we make some really good points, and then we talk about what it means to be, um, To know our cultures versus the real culture and then we went all the way into privacy. So I think we talked about a lot of things today.
[00:36:29] Bruce Y. Lee: Yeah. We talk about being, uh, being a little suspicious about your car and, uh, and, uh, animals farting as well.
[00:36:36] Marco Ciappelli: So, and the worst part, it will be an animal farting in your car.
[00:36:41] Bruce Y. Lee: Yes, that's very problematic. Because they will tell that it's the animal.
[00:36:47] Marco Ciappelli: Exactly. And then there is an old computer making assumption about you. Your car wouldn't know anymore if it's you, if it's an animal. And yeah, you
[00:36:56] Bruce Y. Lee: go to the dealership and when you want to buy your car, he said, Oh, would you like some air fresheners too?
[00:37:03] Marco Ciappelli: I know. Oh my God. This is we're definitely living in a more. exciting world, I think, than ever. If you like to play with technology, I think it's fascinating. I mean, the CHAT GPT from two weeks ago is not the same from today. If you've got a chance to try DALI 3 and talk into your CHAT GPT. And I'm going to give another teaser.
I was just talking to someone yesterday. The new CHAT GPT version of Google, which is BARD, Apparently, it's going to come up with five times the computational power of CHAT GPT. And you can be excited or really scared right now. It's up to you. I don't know how you feel about that, but maybe we can talk about that next time.
Absolutely. All right. Well, Bruce, thank you for, uh, stopping by the bar, which by the way is your bar. And we have decided that. So thank you for having me there and, uh, stay tuned, everybody here for some other conversation.
So be safe and, uh, stay tuned, subscribe and follow us on social media. Bye bye everybody.